the mutant registration act was highly inspiring

I'm always fairly relieved when I write under thirty thousand words, as I'm less likely to overthink it and I don't know if you know this, but the dividing line between 30K and 150K is what we call when I stop to think about what I'm writing. The core, what I actually meant to write, is usually about ten thousand words in there. Call it an executive summary. In my fandom career above the 30K line, there are precisely two exceptions to that, where I needed every word; the second was And All the World Beneath. The first was Jus Ad Bellum, which I'm currently bracing myself to re-read in lieu of X-Men First Class, since this movie completely--and I do mean completely--changed my view of Xavier.

I didn't like him then, and whoo, checking one of my first X-Men fic featuring him using Rogue as a stand-in for Erik---I would say it's not like that, but really, it kind of is--I really, really, really didn't like him, and I forgot that, which is why I'm currently having severe cognitive dissonance. I remember not really caring for him, but apparently, there's a period of time in there that I was ready to kill him, and then finally I did.

Now I feel bad about it, because with First Class canon, he totally could have led a mutant revolt against the humans when mutants were enslaved. He could have kicked great amounts of ass in the camps. He could have made them all kick their own asses. It's upsetting; I killed him because to get a world where the mutants fought back after beign confined to camps, I couldn't have him there, I needed him to catalyze Erik and Scott with his death; I couldn't see him able to take the step they needed that Erik would run with to create a new mutant oligarchy on earth. I couldn't see Scott and Jean and Logan letting themselves be corrupted by the new world order if Xavier could pull them back. I didn't think if he was there, they could do what they had to do to survive.

Do comic fans feel like this when you get a new writer for the series (or hey, Ultimate)? I never was into teh Batman movies enough to feel the dissonance, but I am officially getting a headache from a.) guilt (I--know, leave me alone, I've been McAvoy's since Children of Dune and all that time without a shirt; way to go God!) and also b.) interpretation failure on a massive scale. I don't mind making leaps, but either they are that different in character or I missed something important in the first movie (and later, somewhat, in the second and various cartoons over the years).

I'm not sure I so much got better about writing out my character dislike (see, Smallville; it was a lesson), but I'm not sure I was ever so naked about before X-Men or after.

Also, for the record, I just realized I wrote Erik/Toad and I have no memory of why. I didn't even write slash back then. I didn't even write anything Logan/Rogue! And now I am all confused because ten years ago I didn't like Xavier and I'm pretty sure I didn't care for Erik and now I am in some kind of fugue state when I think of Charles (I think of him as Charles okay?) and realized I've really missed writing the apocalypse. And that I wrote Erik/Toad, and somewhere I have to have some notes on where the hell that came from.

Sometimes I think fanfic writers' problems are kind of unsettling. Feel free to share your own! That's kind of a plea, in case I need to be more transparent here.

Comments

[scy]

Oh yeah, you have it bad, hon. *pats your shoulder*

I am in that 'omg, should I write that?' stage, where I'm not sure it will work right, but it's so damn SHINY that I waaaant to.

ARGH.

[seperis]

*under bed, worried*

I am not writing Erik/Charles/(Emma). I am not.

[domarzione]

Erik/Toad. Oh, why. WHY?

Ultimate was a totally different ball of wax because it was started by Mark Millar and he made everyone totally hateful and awful (entirely killing the fandom in its cradle, says the girl who started the epic and didn't finish it) and then Bendis showed up and made everyone wry and precious like in Ult-Spidey and started raiding canon 616-verse plots for story arcs. It was an unnecessary idea birthed by irresponsible parents, whored out for crack vials and beef jerky, and then placed into foster care with Howard and Marion Cunningham.

But, yes. There are many examples of writers taking meh characters, even meh characters with history, and turning them into something breathtaking. (Bendis, to his credit, took over Daredevil and gave Foggy Nelson an agency that forty years of canon had denied him.) Rick Veitch's The Question miniseries was utter brilliance on behalf of a character that had fallen by the wayside. For mainstream guys, Brad Meltzer gets a lot of shit -- quite deservedly -- for what he does in the DCU (*cough*Identity Crisis*cough*), but he writes the most amazing Roy Harper ever, a thoughtful and insightful man when the rest of the DCU treats him like the perennial superannuated teenager with the unplanned kid and the itinerant lifestyle and the addiction recovery and the inability to focus on what's in front of him. If you met Meltzer's Roy after everyone else's, you'd have a similar reaction to how you're treating Xavier -- *this* is a character I could do stuff with. This is a character I could take over the world with. (Except Roy would stop for beer and pretzels and then a slurpee for his daughter, which is not Xavier's thing as much.)

[seperis]

Erik/Toad. Oh, why. WHY?

My original author notes seem to indicate I was having a temper tantrum against All W/R Writers Suck As They Only Write W/R And Suck. The only explanation I have for pairing is I didn't write Xavier (much) and I was having a temper tantrum, and nothing is quite like writing Erik/Toad while Erik is thinking of Charles and Rogue is sharing the memory with Toad. God I love this fandom: i can write that sentence and it makes sense.

It was an unnecessary idea birthed by irresponsible parents, whored out for crack vials and beef jerky, and then placed into foster care with Howard and Marion Cunningham.

...you have a way with metaphors. OR something. *awed* That is beautiful.

I'm fascinated how readers have handled comic shifts like that. I never thought about how complex that would be before. Thank you. *mulling*

(I could totally take over the world with Charles. I just sit around thinking of exciting ways for him and Erik to do it. It's giddy.)

[scy]

And I should add that Ultimate X-men has a host of issues that can send me off on rants, and yeah, rewriting canon can go WELL, or so badly that you want to chuck the book at the wall.

This Charles, he could lead a revolution, and make you think that it was your idea, and more importantly, he would do it saying 'well, it's the best thing to do.' He has much narrower lines in many ways, and some of them he will step over for his loved ones, and some he will blur for them.

IDK, I have always liked Erik, in his many incarnations, and thought (since I was so young it was hard to reach the comics racks) that he and Charles had the messiest divorce EVER, and should really run a combined school. Because, really, at the end of the day, they are the one person that they other can speak to, even if they don't agree, and the one that they KNOW will keep them in check, no matter what.

[out_there]

I'm always fairly relieved when I write under thirty thousand words, as I'm less likely to overthink it and I don't know if you know this, but the dividing line between 30K and 150K is what we call when I stop to think about what I'm writing.

Hee. Personally, my tipping point is around 8k. Under 8k it's a short story, it's fun, and it doesn't get overthought. It gets written and beta'd and done. Once I hit the 8k mark, there's a chance this will be anything from 10k to 40k in words (I've only gone over that twice and they were my Sports Night Epics which will probably never be repeated again... okay, there might be a Jeeves & Wooster one too that's around that, but I'm sure that's it.) and then I have to work out how to get from *here* to *the end*.

Strangely enough, 8k is also always where I stop and wonder if:
a) this thing has plot, and if it does, is it interesting to anyone other than me? Is it worth reading a whole story for?
b) are these characters still themselves, or is this starrting to head into Mills'n'Boon melodrama and cut-out character land?
c) Given that this is the turmoil here, and the happy ending is all the way over there, how do I stretch that divide? Because this is always the point where half of me would like to tack on a "and they lived happily ever after" line and finish it, (and go write something new) rather than stick it through to the eventual ending.
d) How am I going to find the time to write this stuff? (Mind you, once I work out the answer to C, the time is never really an issue. It's just a pretend issue that worries me mid-fic.)

And now I am all confused because ten years ago I didn't like Xavier and I'm pretty sure I didn't care for Erik and now I am in some kind of fugue state when I think of Charles (I think of him as Charles okay?) and realized I've really missed writing the apocalypse.

I figure it's probably fannish maturity. I swear, some characters become appealing as you grow older and start to see their side of the story (Phantom of the Opera is a perfect example for me. At 13-16 years old, the Phantom was my favourite and Roaul was dull and boring. By 25-30 years old, I can see the appeal in a nice, wealthy, non-psychotic boyfriend and gut instinct knows the Phantom is very *wrong*.).

Plus, y'know, Charles is different from Xavier. He is. Charles is young and fun and interesting, practical but still enjoying life. Xavier can be, well, a bit of a killjoy; he's a good man, but he's someone who's spent so much time consciously being a good person that it's second nature, that he's careful and considerate and wise. And while that can be a great person as a leader (and good for the human race) that's surprisingly hard to love on a personal level. In Magneto v. Xavier, Magneto has more passion, more drive -- it might be misguided but you can fall for passion far easier than you can fall for reasonableness and patience. Whereas in Erik v. Charles, they're both so *young*, so full of potential and flaws, and there's such a possibility that things should be able to turn out right.

YMMV, of course, but while I've always loved Erik and Magneto (and, oh, that time in comics when he was Joseph, too), it's Charles that makes me want to love Xavier a lot more.

[seperis]

At 13-16 years old, the Phantom was my favourite and Roaul was dull and boring. By 25-30 years old, I can see the appeal in a nice, wealthy, non-psychotic boyfriend and gut instinct knows the Phantom is very *wrong*.

...you read Susan Kay's Phanton didn't you? Somewhere in my Great Plastic Bin of Everything I Wrote Before Computers, a red spiral notebook has the sequel to that half-written. It included Raul locking Christine up and telling people she was crazy, but she escaped to find the Phantom. Was. Alive.

YMMV, of course, but while I've always loved Erik and Magneto (and, oh, that time in comics when he was Joseph, too), it's Charles that makes me want to love Xavier a lot more.

Yesssss. He's so young and ridiculous and sweet and ruthless and those shouldn't go together, but they do, and I'm like "MINDWHAMMY MORE PEOPLE PLZ".

[nagasvoice]

I've had occasional horrifying moments of cognitive dissonance where I realized a character looked like X at first (hated them!) and then, guess what, they're not even a frenenmy of your hero, they're just a reality check, and they won't shut up and get run over so easily as all that. And...then they get interesting. And maybe it turns out they're a lot smarter than your hero, in lots of odd ways.
To make a fairly sloppy HP fandom analogy (because I'm not expert on it and don't write it myself) this might be like finding out Snape (nasty teacher who you hated at first) is your best bet among all the teachers to keep things running at the darn Hogwarts school, and damn good at your back when the whole world is turning into a combat zone. And then wit and intellect is always hawt, isn't it? Arrrrgh.
Or finding out a beta reader is right about some major story issues, and you might as well toss up the whole card deck in the air and start right over.
Or that your beta reader is right on some things but totally clueless on others, and you actually are looking at a totally different piece of advice than you thought you were working with. Like you completely did not realize one of your best friends was so appallingly blank and ignorant on a touchy issue you'd assumed they knew all about, and it changes your entire world view about them and about *how you pick out your friends.*
Or fighting with them-- people leave fandoms because it's so painful to keep dealing with that person they fought with, or keep fighting with.
That kind of cognitive dissonance is outright painful. For days, because your entire view of people and how they tick and what you do about them is in a heap like a Rube Goldbergian thing that the cat shoved off the table.
"Ooops, where you working on that?"
It takes awhile to sort out where your prior world view was inaccurate, and tinker with it. It doesn't even matter how trivial the actual trigger may be, the total flipflop is so massively distracting.
For me, that kind of stuff stays with me for *days.* It can have an arc to the stress, just like running a fever.
It takes some real managing to keep it from occupying my brain when I need it for other stuff. You know, like, driving cars, and work. Walking and chewing gum at the same time, stuff like that.
I don't know if you're asking for advice on managing the pain, but hey, every little management idea helps, I think.
I've been forced to handle it the same way I handle panic, or intrusive, repetitive thinking about some upcoming dreaded event: Set it firmly aside, tell myself I'm not working on that right now, and turn my attention on Something Else that needs doing. It helps if it's tangible, physical, real. Take out the trash, clean the catbox (phew! that'll get your attention), get the hose out and water the plants. Pet the darn cat who threw everything on the floor, perhaps. Now, if you've been doing that set-aside bit for 2-3 days, little bits have kind of settled out of the air, maybe you've talked to some folks about it, things are calmer, you can see the icky jagged bits where your map of the situation just cracked and broke right off.
Also, while I'm Not Thinking About That, maybe I've collected some random info on the problem, picked up a bunch of little notes, started a research file to start pushing out the debris and getting moving again. When I'm ready, I'll start piling that stuff together and see if any of it holds together.
And if it's still too much, I just go back to playing Cleopatra with the palm fronds for awhile longer, get that Rowing Down De Nile going again.

[cesare]

I don't think you should feel bad about disliking Xavier. He's always been a frustratingly oblique character, as if writers mostly couldn't imagine how a man could believe in peace and co-existence without personally being a cardboard saint. And so patronizing! As someone noted over on marina's DW, dozens of plots in the comics boil down to "Stuff happens and Professor X refuses to let the X-Men know what's going on until the villain shows up and tells them the truth." In the previous movie trilogy, they leaned hard on the fact that Patrick Stewart played Xavier and automatically won the audience over in large part just because hey, it's Patrick Stewart. He gave Xavier some dry humor and some hints of doubt and woe, but mostly Xavier was convinced he was right, and the movies agreed with him, and that was that.

Charles though! Charles is an almost inexplicably horrible person. He reads minds to score with chicks! (And I'm sure he thinks he's being quite the white knight by doing so, since after all, he could just make women think they wanted him, so only cheating a little by totally violating their privacy is practically fair play.) He changes peoples' minds when he doesn't feel like persuading them! I was amazed that the movie went there, and somehow James MacAvoy made it all seem so inevitable and human that now, like you, for the first time he's Charles to me, and I'm kind of in love.

[seperis]

He had me at 'mutations are groovy'. I melted right into the floor. Just--Charles. Yes. Please. Mindfuck more people please.

[margrave]

YES! Yes, I UNDERSTAND!

My relationship with Jason Todd is one of COMPLETE and UTTER wreck of a relationship filled with HATE, LOVE, GUILT, HEARTBREAK (in that order) that is made WORSE by DIFFERENT writers writing him. Yes, the guilt is always there, but you also learn to IGNORE big chunks of canon, which I just don't do in any other medium but comics.

And honestly speaking, my feelings toward Charles (like you, I have NOT being able to call him anything but Charles since the film) was pretty much DISLIKE and WHY HIM?! And just, I was all TEAM!MAGNETO! And then this film, oh, glorious, I NOW I JUST LOVE him and ADORE him, and I admit not filled with much guilt because this is comics, and with comics you pick and choose what you like and ignore the rest. Hell, the writers do it themselves.

[seperis]

Oh I have heard stories from Jason Todd fans. I feel so bad for them.

And honestly speaking, my feelings toward Charles (like you, I have NOT being able to call him anything but Charles since the film) was pretty much DISLIKE and WHY HIM?! And just, I was all TEAM!MAGNETO! And then this film, oh, glorious, I NOW I JUST LOVE him and ADORE him, and I admit not filled with much guilt because this is comics, and with comics you pick and choose what you like and ignore the rest. Hell, the writers do it themselves.

I admit, every time he mindwhammied, I loved him more. Just love.

[casspeach]

I hated Xavier in the first movies, even though Patrick Stewart! I think a lot of it is that he was just so smug, and a lot of it was the whole 'oh hey, Scott, trusted leader of my X-men. I know you and your crack first-flight team have logged many hours in the Danger Room learning to function as an efficient unit, but take this weird Canadian with anger issues and no memory and a tendency to just fuck off at inconvenient moments on this mission, would you?'

Which may have something to do with a) my ridiculous love for Scott and b) my massive hate-on for Wolverine. I just, seriously, do.not.get why people like him (apologies if you do, it's just a mystery to me).

I totally love Charles though. He's such an arse, and yet completely adorable and the end of the film made me cry like a baby.

I don't find Erik/Toad much of a leap either. I shall go looking for that after work :-)

[seperis]

*g* I love Wolverine, but I totally get people that hate him. I had (have?) a ton of Scott fans as friends, and it makes sense.

I totally love Charles though. He's such an arse, and yet completely adorable and the end of the film made me cry like a baby.

My entire theatre was choked up. I was at teh midnight showing and I swear there were gangbangers behind me whimpering. They also knew all the injokes, which made me feel like a total loser as a geek there.

I don't find Erik/Toad much of a leap either. I shall go looking for that after work :-)

Grey Water in case you are still curious. *g*

[feanna]

I have thus far spent HOURS creating several OCs in a verse where Erik and Charles stay together after the beach. This involves backstory going back to WW2, a healer, non-mutants, MPREG (with Shaw as the "other" dad, baby inherits his powers) and a local Jewish/mutant(mostly small time)/other community in the states that also kind of adopts baby Jean (as in Jean Grey) or really, she adopts them.

And then Charles and Erik contact one member of the community when they start looking for mutants again and this person is all, well, we should really get everybody together to discuss all of this/Charles reads stuff in somebody's mind and then Charles and Erik get dropped into this existing community and there are even one or two people who remember that boy that Shaw (or Dr. Schmidt as they know him) was suddenly all about.

THIS IS WHAT MY BRAIN DOES TO ME, AND I CAN'T EVEN WRITE (sadface!), WHAT IS THIS?



Also, is this the wrong time and place to mention (re:length) that while I totally enjoyed what x-men-fic you've posted so far, there were some transitions where I could have used a bit more explanations? (Though I do think I got it at the end and I was sleep deprived in there, but there were one or two moments when I was all: What's this now??) ; P

[feanna]

Also, I am totally calling them Charles and Erik, I mean I love the explanation for how they got to be called Professor X and Magneto, which is that the kids essentially came up with ridiculous nicknames for they're dads while they were goofing around, and they were having some SERIOUS fun there! and the mood they were in is exactly how seriously I can take people called Profeesor X and Magneto, I mean I get it as a kind of cover identity or role they play, and maybe in some verse(ses) they lose the rest of themselves mostly, but I can't see them thinking of eah other as anything but Charles and Erik and if they stay together that's who they are, SO! THERE!

TL;DR: Charles is so much nicer than Xavier (especially if you know the German version of Xavier, which is Xaver and is basically pronounces Ksafer, which is just not on).

[ratcreature]

I think when you last as a superhero comic fan for longer than two years or so, you get used to contradictory canon, characterizations and reboots, so that you just pick and choose what you like, and then build your own head-canon. Then you tend to (dis-)like official editorial moves based on that, only to be sometimes swayed by rather brilliant reimaginations anyway. It's somewhat like reading fanfic in a fandom with relatively little canon material but a ton of fanfic that builds on some kernel into all directions. Also a bit like fairy tales, where something like Red Riding Hood can be told and retold as pretty much anything, yet you can still see the fairy tale in it.

[seperis]

That's brilliant; fandom as the success of folklore. I do like that a lot.

[npkedit]

If you love comics, you have to learn to live with the headaches that come with the retcons, changes, etc. And the reinterpretations that are often enough to send your head spinning ("I love you wife," sent Cyclops-loving me in a rage away from the comics for a very long time). Or you just ignore them. That's what fic is for ;)

On the other hand, if it makes you feel better, Jus ad Bellum is still a masterpiece of fic (I even referenced it a couple of days ago when speaking of stories that should have won awards that they didn't get!).

[seperis]

Thank you! That's so sweet! I'm still bracing myself; X-Men I did a lot of first person pov (which I almost never do now) and I keep wondering if it stands the test of time. I started posting it ten years ago in August and finished it nine years ago in September; until War Games, I've never been that utterly ambitious in building a full out world from the ground up (excluding crossovers).

If you love comics, you have to learn to live with the headaches that come with the retcons, changes, etc. And the reinterpretations that are often enough to send your head spinning ("I love you wife," sent Cyclops-loving me in a rage away from the comics for a very long time).

Context? *intensely curious*

[libitina]

Have you read anthem for the already defeated by liketheroad? It needs a bit of editing, but it has a certain way of breaking things in order to fix them that made me think of you.

[averzierlia.livejournal.com]

I'm um. co-authoring a fic for stbb and its...hard. Way harder than I thought it would be because we have to keep passing it back and forth and I've never written anything even close to this long and I want to cry because she's not really a stxi writer so I have to like, rework her parts sometimes and seriously she's just lucky I love her because I want to set this fic on fire even if I know I'll love it at the end. I don't know if anyone else will love it, but whatever.

[seperis.livejournal.com]

Oh man, cowrites, yes this. *hugs you* It's stressful. Even with cowriters who were fandom and style simpatico could be--stressful.

[kityye.livejournal.com]

The four X-men fanfics I wrote when I was 16, right after the first movie came out, are on fanfiction.net. In the last 2 months, they've randomly started getting people favoriting them and me. I find it awkward and can't even bring myself to go re-read them to try to figure out the minds of the people liking them.

[seperis.livejournal.com]

I got feedback on a few that I'm not embarrassed by, but I'm just starting at some of the utterly naked character hate and wincing so hard on some of the others.

*curious* What was your pairing?

[cathalin.livejournal.com]

That is actually fascinating. Hmm, the only thing I can kind of analogize to is LOTR, in that the movies verse version of the characters in some cases completely changed my concept of individual characters and also their interrelationships. (But it wasn't like I'd written any of them, which is a whole other level of investment).

I haven't read the comics so only have familiarity with the movies... But am I getting your meaning right that you're saying that the Charles of First Class is more ambiguous -- and potentially scarier than comics/earlier movie versions? I have found myself thinking a lot about what it would take to push him over the line. Actually I have a couple of ideas along those lines -- and I do think it's totally possible to see this Charles decide he had to protect what was near and dear to him. Of course, humans aiming nuclear missiles at them wasn't enough, so maybe the characterization you saw earlier is still basically there?

Is Erik's characterization in First Class similarly different or is that more consistent with the comics?

(Also, apparently there are fics of yours I haven't read, which I thought wasn't actually possible lol.)

[seperis.livejournal.com]

I just posted an X-Men First Class one!

It's weird--for Trek, I shifted series to TOS, but I didn't have an inherit change in my favorite character, though I definitely like Jim more now. Considering my fic leanings (its' not like you can't guess those) and my faint dislike of Xavier, I went in leaning Erik and came out so pro-Charles it's kind of insane. And pro-Erik, obviously, but Charles enchants me. He uses his power and he's not afraid of it and he doesn't hobble himself in the use. New. World. Order.

And yes, this Charles is scarier. Professor Xavier was the X-Men leader but not team leader and I always assumed I was reading it due to his wheelchair, but it's the personality difference; this Charles doesn't need to walk to be their leader in ideology and in combat.

[ellixis.livejournal.com]

For a while, I got kind of twitchy about comic book movies and new writers and new games. And then it occurred to me, in a blinding flash of light, that I could accept them if I decided they were just AUs. And then I was okay. So that's something fanfic has helped me with.

I'm kind of terrible at writing fanfic, though, so I don't have much to share in the way of trials and tribulations.

[dragongirl16.livejournal.com]

I think McAvoy put an entirely different spin on Charles' personality with this reboot. Don't get me wrong, I adore Sir Patrick Stewart's portrayal of Xavier in the first X-men movies, but that Xavier is a much more benign, almost saint rather than the creature we get in First Class.

McAvoy's Xavier is much more approachable for the viewer. He's down at the pub, he's hitting (and failing) on girls, he has terrible pick up lines - this is not the calm saint who barely bats an eye at anything. McAvoy's Xavier is closer to the Xavier we, the viewer, can relate to; he's got failings, he's not the untouchable saint on a pedestal. He's got no problems using his powers to manipulate the FBI/CIA, he does put his fellow mutants first over humans and is very protective of them. I view this as far different from the peace pushing, everybody love each other Xavier from the first few movies.

Now I get to the part of First Class that bothered me, in regards to both nu!Xavier and nu!Erik's characters: the beach scene, before the missiles. Erik comes out of that sub with a massive personality change. We don't really get a heads up to the grandiose speech that falls out of his mouth at that point. During the whole movie, Erik is a Nazi hunter (GO MAN KILL 'EM ALL), a terrible motivator, dead sexy in a turtleneck, and Protective!Erik when Charles is about to get squished on the Blackbird - but then, he does a one eighty and goes all megalomaniac and preachy. There is something in that scene that just does not jive for me. I would have bought it - right up to the point where Charles reaches out with his mind to confirm the missile strike. Charles, up to this point, has agreed with Erik about his protective stance towards mutants. So why the ever loving FUCK does Charles make a plea for Erik to save the humans when he knows that the military will just fire again?

And, for that matter, why didn't they fire again? Didn't think about that before, but the captains should have said, fuck it, let's try again, because there's a threat to be eliminated on the beach. So, unless something happens that the viewer doesn't get to see, it makes no sense that Charles and company were just left on that beach, free and clear.

Sorry, left field. Where was I? So. The rift at the end of First Class doesn't make a lot of sense to me. During the entire movie (and even after the damn beach scene) we see a Charles that's dead set on protecting his mutants from harm, up to even wiping a human's memory clean - so why the fuck does he disagree with Erik on the beach? Yeah, I get that Charles would be all about not killing people - BUT. I think his character should have known Erik's personality enough that Charles would have argued against killing the humans so that they, the mutants, could mitigate the horror that's about to come down on them if Erik did go about with the return missile strike and not tried to argue that the men on those boats were just following orders.

As for the comic-canon Xavier - I remember a Xavier that sat in the gray areas a lot more than the noble shining saint of the first few films. There was a particular issue - god I can't remember which, but it was the one where Magic died from the Legacy virus and the Professor, for reasons I don't remember at the moment, can walk for the day, and Jubilee takes him roller blading. The First Class Charles reminds me of that guy and not Stewart's portrayal of the man.

I guess one other problem I have with Charles being set up as a saint is that he's a telepath. He's probably seen the darkest part of every person's soul. He should at least be a little more pragmatic than Stewart's version - and McAvoy brings a little of that to the stage with his version of Charles. So I guess that's why the ending of First Class drives me a little crazy with the need to fix the fucking thing.

tl;dr - Stewart played Xavier as a saint on a pedestal. McAvoy gave Charles feet of clay. We dig the feet of clay, man. He's much more fuckable.

[casspeach.livejournal.com]

So much this. Put much better than I could have.

Although I would say not only more fuckable - which sorry Sir Patrick but yes, McAvoy edges ahead of you there - but more likeable.

I do think it's a shame they didn't leave the becoming enemies on opposing sides thing for another movie, bot because another movie, and also because yes, they went to that beach too close together in ideology to buy the sudden shift easily.

[winterlive.livejournal.com]

you are just excellent, okay?

[seperis.livejournal.com]

I'm currently trying to work out a plot where Charles merrily mindfucks entire armies and I am so going to hell, but he'd be so like, awesome doing it!

*Happy*

I love you more.

[20thcenturyvole.livejournal.com]

Someone, I can't remember who, pointed out that in the first three X-Men movies Xavier spends the climax incapacitated in some way - comatose in the first one, mind-controlled in the second, and dead in the third - because, from a storytelling point of view, that's pretty much the only way to get around the problem question of "So why doesn't Xavier just wheel in there, freeze everybody, have his X-Men concentrate on taking down Magneto who would now be their only problem, and basically just save the day with his scary telepathy?" Because seriously, that thing he did at the museum in the beginning of X-Men 2? That is the most frighteningly casual display of power ever. Stryker, and then Magneto, try to use his telepathy to commit global genocide, because with him that shit is totally just a slip in sanity away. I think making Xavier into a near-saint is pretty much the only way to have him as a protagonist; I can't see a way to wield mind-control powers like his and get much of a moral grey area.

TL;DR I'm pretty sure if Erik had Charles' powers he would have taken over the world by teatime.

[seperis.livejournal.com]

Stryker, and then Magneto, try to use his telepathy to commit global genocide, because with him that shit is totally just a slip in sanity away.

That is the greatest quote in history. I just keep reading it and going "Oh hell yes."

...was that the wrong reaction? I'll happily take "mind controlled world of willing followers in a cult-like religion" which--oh God, why am I thinking this?

[crabby-lioness.livejournal.com]

Yes, Charles could consume the world if he were pushed far enough. That's what "Omega Class" means. The question is, what could push him that far?

You need to read Mike Carey's X-Men Legacy. Xavier is one of the main protagonists in that book, along with Rogue and Magneto. Carey breaks Xavier and rebuilds him along more pro-active lines. He's still reluctant to hurt anyone, but he's got no compunction against using his mind control abilities to create elaborate mental restraints that will allow him to walk among entire teams of violent mutants who hate him and try to persuade them to join him. His recent "conversation" with the Juggernaut and recruitment of the Accolytes involved immense displays of telepathic power and control. I've written an introduction to it here: http://crabby-lioness.livejournal.com/70706.html

[greenet.livejournal.com]

I just ordered Divided He Stands entirely due to the movie. I have high hopes!

Also, do you happen to know the Omega Class mutants on the top of your head? I know Jean Grey, Bobby Drake, and Remy was at one point when Nicieza was writing him.... Ororo? The Nates and Rachel?

[crabby-lioness.livejournal.com]

Oh, and if you really want to see Erik and Charles take over the world, that's House of M: Civil War: http://www.amazon.com/House-M-Civil-Christos-Gage/dp/0785133801/