meta rec - tnh: the fail years

tnh: the fail years by chopchica

I don't know but I can make an educated guess how many people here have been reading along with the cultural appropriation and race debates going around LJ. For context, rydra_wong has a fantastic collection of links here.

Up until now, I could squint and kind of see how the defenders of tnh were seeing the situation. And to be honest, considering how often I've lost my temper online and said things I regret, I wanted to believe it wasn't--well, what it is to be honest. It's not a hotheaded reaction or--I mean, I fail this one, too. I don't know what to call concentrated malice dressed in self-righteous hypocricy.

This post isn't defensible. The comments aren't defensible. There's nothing that can justify the level of malice expressed there from what I've read over the last week in rydra_wong's links.

See link to chopchica's post for more, please.

Comments

[leld.livejournal.com]

... I really want to write a letter and send it to Tor books, and as many of it's authors and editors I can find contact info for, stating that if tnh is an accurate representation of their beliefs, attitudes, and behavior then I will not be giving them any of my business and will tell everyone I know the same. I just need to figure out how much time that would take.

[seperis.livejournal.com]

I can't say I wouldn't be tempted. Though I admit, this has turned me off of Tor books. I've never really paid attention to publishers before, but I get the feeling in the future, that's something I am going to notice.

[vito-excalibur.livejournal.com]

Patrick Nielsen Hayden is an editor for Tor. I think that Teresa no longer is. Probably should check on that before writing. I think professionally she is now the moderator on boingboing.

Either way, while I have a list of authors I will no longer read, I am less sure that boycotting Tor the entire publishing house is a good idea. If it even had an effect, the price would be mostly paid by authors, you know? Authors who probably didn't have much of a say in what editor they got or even what house they got published with.

[malkingrey.livejournal.com]

I feel that I have to state, just for the record, that Teresa Nielsen Hayden is a friend of mine and has been for many years.

To say more than that, under the circumstances, probably isn't wise.

[seperis.livejournal.com]

I'm not--holding her friends or defenders responsible for her in any way. This isn't a judgment on you. I do judge her from what I've seen and read, and judge some of those who attacked others in her defense.

[malkingrey.livejournal.com]

Fair enough. She's a big girl, and can take her own lumps.

[lanning.livejournal.com]

God, what repulsive behavior. It makes my head hurt. Why is she digging herself in deeper and deeper? She's making herself a poster-girl for Asshole on the Internet. *sigh*

[seperis.livejournal.com]

God, I know. It's actually freaking me out. I really, really want to grab her keyboard and exile her to anywhere else for about a week until she's calmer. I just--I don't know.

tnh

[brambls.livejournal.com]

I read through most of that at 6 a.m. and sat trying to decide on a response and went to bed instead. I'm rather flabbergasted at the whole thing.

I don't know her and at this point I don't want to know her. But I hope she realizes that, by posting in a blog in a community of blogs, people outside her world are reading this explosion and making judgments based on it. We don't know her and we don't care that previously she's been an even-tempered and thoughtful person because at this point it's hearsay.

I also hope she realizes that, regardless of whether she actually has the rank to ban a beginning author or that blacklists within a publishing house exist, she made a threat bringing her professional life into her private life.

Not only did she muddy those waters, she broke the dam. People are well within their right to question whether they want to continue purchasing books via Tor. I don't want my spending money going to support, in anyway, a company that fosters that kind of "my kingdom, my rules" mentality.

Re: tnh

[seperis.livejournal.com]

God, this. The fact she even brought that stuff up says something.

[brownbetty]

Oh, gah. I want to like TNH. She's an opinionated, smart, independent woman. She can smack a troll so hard his dad walks funny! *headdesks repeatedly*

[chopchica.livejournal.com]

I *totally* used to like her! Until last week, when I found out that her version of "troll" included "anybody who looks at my hubby funny" and "anybody who disagrees with me" and that she had no range of replies. It was either dead silence or the most vicious poisoned pen possible - no matter what the context.

[seperis.livejournal.com]

*nods* I used to mosey over to Making Light and this completely shocked me.

[fairestcat]

I'm right there with you on this one.

*headdesks some more*

[skadi.livejournal.com]

This is unbelievable. Geez. (Thanks for the links - I've been trying to follow this, and it can get a little difficult because the whole battle is across so many blogs).

[seperis.livejournal.com]

Man. I'm still not caught up. Chop's post was great to distill at least the latest down.

[chopchica.livejournal.com]

You just love me for my rage.

[seperis.livejournal.com]

Baby, it's totally my thing.

[skadi.livejournal.com]

Yeah, and Seek Avalon's timeline post was pretty helpful, too. It seems like there's always more to read, though.

[cathalin.livejournal.com]

concentrated malice dressed in self-righteous hypocricy.

I think this'll do just fine. I had never heard of any of these people, and started following this thing with a completely neutral point of view. I'm not sure I've ever seen a group of people so thoroughly indict themselves by their behavior. Just, wow.

[seperis.livejournal.com]

That shocked me, too. It was so blatant I kept thinking I was reading it wrong. Or something.

[cathalin.livejournal.com]

Yes. I actually re-read a bunch of stuff, because I couldn't believe my initial reading. It seemed impossible that people would be putting the words down that appeared on the screen, and not take them back when people pointed out the fail. I just...

[seperis.livejournal.com]

This. I have used the comparison to a car accident before, or a trainwreck, but this was almost literally the slowest-motion trainwreck in the world with people JUMPING UP AND DOWN saying to put on the damn brakes. It's unreal. I don't think you *could* miss that much without serious effort.

[chopchica.livejournal.com]

JENN I AM SO TIRED