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Friday, November 21st, 2008 02:20 am
episode review: supernatural 4.10
Oh.
I am crushing on Castiel like whoa.
Things That Make Me Wonder
Uriel is the pissiest angel that ever angeled, I have to say. Not that this makes me like him less; if you were bopping around earth with Castiel the human-lover and watching humans for a few thousand years doing their level best to self-destruct, you'd be pretty grumpy too. For some reason the ape bit struck me--I have this image of him around during Darwin's lectures going "I KNEW IT. SPEAK IT. APES IN PANTS EVEN." Which makes no sense, but I never promise sense. I'm just saying, Darwin groupie. Also, I bet that insult worked loads better seventy or so years ago.
Uriel's neat. He's sarcastic and driven and kind of vicious and embodies Wrath inside a very thin layer of humanesque skin. I really want to see him with a flaming sword. He doesn't like humans. I mean, even in a theoretical sort of way. I'd almost say resentment, which makes me wonder if his celestial version of hatred for Anna was at least in part not Disobedience, capital D, but wanting to be one of them. What I'm not sure of either way, though it makes me curious, if he hates humans in that eww, beneath me way, or hates them because of the gift they received of free will that he wants for himself (aka Lucifer which I keep wanting to spell with a v and don't know why), or hates them because of their abuse of that gift. Basically, I could be convinced on any of them but I lean toward b just because the idea fascinates me.
The thing that makes me wonder is, considering Uriel's not-very-divorced-from-his-ape-skin-emotions, if possessing a human subjects angels to being less in the way of angelically neutral and more human. In their pure form, sure, they are the ultimate in embodiment of God's will, but I have to think that living in a human shell and being subject to flesh has to have an effect of some kind. Even if it's muted.
There's also the fact that Uriel was carrying around Anna's grace and that was malice. I just--no matter what Anna et al say about angels having no feelings, Uriel in humansuit is either more subject to them than anyone admits, or Uriel is ripe for a hard Fall. Lucifer hated humans too, didn't he? Resented their free will? If this is going that direction, I am so there.
This is not a way to ship Dean/Castiel. I ship them sans thoughts on the subject.
Things That Make Me Happy
Castiel is--I don't even know. I love his complexity. I love his not-exactly-innocence, and his sweetness, and that terrifying bedrock center of him that's absolute stillness compared to Uriel's constant inner motion. I love that he likes Dean, because he would, and he likes humans, and he finds the world beautiful and worth saving. And I wonder if it was Anna's fall that did it for him, or if he was already sympathetic and watched her fall and wished he could join her. And if that is why he was sent to Dean in the first place, because seriously, I cannot see Uriel dragging Dean out of hell. I mean, I try, because hey, God's will. And I just can't.
Castiel is my crack. I love him and his coat and unbuttoned collar and the way he thinks about everything even while he does it.
Dean waiting thirty years to go to the dark side is cool, but what's weirdly cooler is if it's possible, if this is how demons are made, couldn't they just group together and take over and get out? I'm just saying, uprising in hell isn't the worst idea ever. There's something in that which is teasing my memory, but I'm not sure what it is. My theology is sketchy and odd, but you know, even if the more powerful demons of hell are the ones that accompanied Lucifer, pretty sure humans outnumber them. I don't know where I'm going with this, but in a war between heaven and earth, that seems significant. Ruby came back, after all, in whatever morally ambiguous way she has. John Winchester went somewhere not-hell, because Dean would have seen him if he was still there, as that would be traumatic for him and they were all about eternal trauma.
I am in the minority on this, but I like this Ruby a lot better than the other one. I don't know why, but she works for me the way that the other one just irritated me. I think part of it was the other Ruby never felt as close to understandable, or human, as this one did. The girl crawled out of hell at least twice trying to save humanity knowing what her fate would be. That's freaking awesome, and I feel it in her this time around, what it cost her and why she might have done it.
Anna was just neat. I liked her humanity and how when she remembered what she was, it felt like she was so much more. And I loved how she knew what Dean had gone through and how he had to forgive himself. And how Dean slept with an angel which was totally coming since Sam is nailing a demon and the universe likes symmetry. He's as fallen as she is in a way, from human to demon, like she went from angel to human.
Other Points to Ponder
Seriously, Uriel, watch that resentment. Your grace feels very thin.
Dean crying is never going to not hurt. Sam, this is a time for hugging. I mean, really. That was a a lightning strike of hugging-need there.
Demon uprising, good idea, bad idea?
And where did Anna go? I like to think she went straight to the Throne; being an angel can't necessarily exempt her from the law, but then again, if she was the superior to Castiel and Uriel, it's not like they can discipline her and I doubt she chose to redux to Hell.
(And okay, I was getting The Last Unicorn vibes all over the place on that. I wonder if returning to grace changes what she's become. I kind of want to think it doesn't. I mean, example Uriel of not being a numb ball of light. Which again, if they are going for a hard Fall to Hell with him, I'm riveted.)
Castiel watching Anna and Dean was fascinating. I don't know what it was, and I don't know what I want it to be. Castiel likes them both. I wonder if he's the reason they never came for Anna before now.
And that's my thoughts. And my continuing hope of Dean/Castiel, because wow. Just. Wow.
I am crushing on Castiel like whoa.
Things That Make Me Wonder
Uriel is the pissiest angel that ever angeled, I have to say. Not that this makes me like him less; if you were bopping around earth with Castiel the human-lover and watching humans for a few thousand years doing their level best to self-destruct, you'd be pretty grumpy too. For some reason the ape bit struck me--I have this image of him around during Darwin's lectures going "I KNEW IT. SPEAK IT. APES IN PANTS EVEN." Which makes no sense, but I never promise sense. I'm just saying, Darwin groupie. Also, I bet that insult worked loads better seventy or so years ago.
Uriel's neat. He's sarcastic and driven and kind of vicious and embodies Wrath inside a very thin layer of humanesque skin. I really want to see him with a flaming sword. He doesn't like humans. I mean, even in a theoretical sort of way. I'd almost say resentment, which makes me wonder if his celestial version of hatred for Anna was at least in part not Disobedience, capital D, but wanting to be one of them. What I'm not sure of either way, though it makes me curious, if he hates humans in that eww, beneath me way, or hates them because of the gift they received of free will that he wants for himself (aka Lucifer which I keep wanting to spell with a v and don't know why), or hates them because of their abuse of that gift. Basically, I could be convinced on any of them but I lean toward b just because the idea fascinates me.
The thing that makes me wonder is, considering Uriel's not-very-divorced-from-his-ape-skin-emotions, if possessing a human subjects angels to being less in the way of angelically neutral and more human. In their pure form, sure, they are the ultimate in embodiment of God's will, but I have to think that living in a human shell and being subject to flesh has to have an effect of some kind. Even if it's muted.
There's also the fact that Uriel was carrying around Anna's grace and that was malice. I just--no matter what Anna et al say about angels having no feelings, Uriel in humansuit is either more subject to them than anyone admits, or Uriel is ripe for a hard Fall. Lucifer hated humans too, didn't he? Resented their free will? If this is going that direction, I am so there.
This is not a way to ship Dean/Castiel. I ship them sans thoughts on the subject.
Things That Make Me Happy
Castiel is--I don't even know. I love his complexity. I love his not-exactly-innocence, and his sweetness, and that terrifying bedrock center of him that's absolute stillness compared to Uriel's constant inner motion. I love that he likes Dean, because he would, and he likes humans, and he finds the world beautiful and worth saving. And I wonder if it was Anna's fall that did it for him, or if he was already sympathetic and watched her fall and wished he could join her. And if that is why he was sent to Dean in the first place, because seriously, I cannot see Uriel dragging Dean out of hell. I mean, I try, because hey, God's will. And I just can't.
Castiel is my crack. I love him and his coat and unbuttoned collar and the way he thinks about everything even while he does it.
Dean waiting thirty years to go to the dark side is cool, but what's weirdly cooler is if it's possible, if this is how demons are made, couldn't they just group together and take over and get out? I'm just saying, uprising in hell isn't the worst idea ever. There's something in that which is teasing my memory, but I'm not sure what it is. My theology is sketchy and odd, but you know, even if the more powerful demons of hell are the ones that accompanied Lucifer, pretty sure humans outnumber them. I don't know where I'm going with this, but in a war between heaven and earth, that seems significant. Ruby came back, after all, in whatever morally ambiguous way she has. John Winchester went somewhere not-hell, because Dean would have seen him if he was still there, as that would be traumatic for him and they were all about eternal trauma.
I am in the minority on this, but I like this Ruby a lot better than the other one. I don't know why, but she works for me the way that the other one just irritated me. I think part of it was the other Ruby never felt as close to understandable, or human, as this one did. The girl crawled out of hell at least twice trying to save humanity knowing what her fate would be. That's freaking awesome, and I feel it in her this time around, what it cost her and why she might have done it.
Anna was just neat. I liked her humanity and how when she remembered what she was, it felt like she was so much more. And I loved how she knew what Dean had gone through and how he had to forgive himself. And how Dean slept with an angel which was totally coming since Sam is nailing a demon and the universe likes symmetry. He's as fallen as she is in a way, from human to demon, like she went from angel to human.
Other Points to Ponder
Seriously, Uriel, watch that resentment. Your grace feels very thin.
Dean crying is never going to not hurt. Sam, this is a time for hugging. I mean, really. That was a a lightning strike of hugging-need there.
Demon uprising, good idea, bad idea?
And where did Anna go? I like to think she went straight to the Throne; being an angel can't necessarily exempt her from the law, but then again, if she was the superior to Castiel and Uriel, it's not like they can discipline her and I doubt she chose to redux to Hell.
(And okay, I was getting The Last Unicorn vibes all over the place on that. I wonder if returning to grace changes what she's become. I kind of want to think it doesn't. I mean, example Uriel of not being a numb ball of light. Which again, if they are going for a hard Fall to Hell with him, I'm riveted.)
Castiel watching Anna and Dean was fascinating. I don't know what it was, and I don't know what I want it to be. Castiel likes them both. I wonder if he's the reason they never came for Anna before now.
And that's my thoughts. And my continuing hope of Dean/Castiel, because wow. Just. Wow.
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From:Fascinating like whoa.
Anna is the female conduit through which Dean and Castiel TOTALLY HAD SEX TONIGHT, YOU GUYS.
Heh. She lays out her theory in a numbered list of awesomeness. But Castiel's watching tonight was insanely noticeable. Awesomesauce.
And I had the same thought about angels being unemotional. 'Cause Uriel? Not exactly cool as a cucumber and all that.
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From:Yes! *This.*
I love the Winchesters in and of themselves, I *do*, but it kind of amazes me how *refreshing* Castiel is, both in terms of what he's done to the boys' dynamic and what he (and the general fact of ACTUAL ANGELS) has done to the show's narrative potential. It's *nifty*.
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From:*swoons*
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From:Oh goodness yes. There might've been dolphin noises when that happened. It was an interesting choice to focus on Castiel, since we never actually got Sam's reaction to the Dean/Anna at all. I really hope that it's foreshadowing of sorts, mmm. I'm *so* glad they're keeping Castiel around.
I want to like Ruby because of what they *want* to do with her. She definitely smoothed out a lot since S3's incarnation, and it felt like a very conscious writing choice, to make her more sympathetic to the audience. SPN isn't a show to play deep twists, but I can't help but want to keep one eye open for her to turn against the boys in the end.
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From:Your thoughts about a Hell uprising really tickles my fancy, and I'm very curious at your thoughts.
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From:For me Ruby is about remembered warmth, persistent regret and a basic drive to survive above all else (except Sam with his demon blood, the closest thing to a demon who remembers her own humanity is throwing a wrench in the whole self-survival thing). So, yes, I love this Ruby who gives me snark and layers.
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From:*glee*
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From:Oh gods, YES! I LOVED Bela with the passion of a thousand burning suns. I loved her for being true to her character; unrepentant till the end, and I would pay to see her on the show again.
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From:Though I imagine she got up off her rack long before Dean did. I want Dean/Bela in hell fic.
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From:I really do want to see Bela again, as a demon or just another escapee. Sigh. They totally wasted her potential last year.
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From:Hmmm, Zena did a some stuff with Hell and her taking it over to get out, and I think there have been other movies that have similarly tackled the theme.
That said, maybe you were think of the story of the elbowless arms:
A person was given a vision of Hell and in it saw tables laden with food and all sorts of wonderful things. He was surprised at how great it looked, but on closer inspection saw the people around the table were all sobbing and screaming in hunger, hurting each other in anger - because no one had any elbows so they couldn't bend their arms to bring the food to their mouths and so were starving and in agony.
The person was then given a view of Heaven and in it saw tables laden with food and all sorts of wonderful things. He was surprised because it looked exactly like Hell. Upon closer inspection though, he saw that everyone was happy, despite the fact that they also had no elbows and couldn't feed themselves. In heaven, people were feeding each other.
So, the whole idea of that story is that in Hell people weren't able to work together to do anything, even something as necessary as eating because they couldn't cooperate together or trust each other to help. So there could never be an uprising in Hell because there is no trust or cooperation.
So it's possible that's what was niggling at the back of your mind?
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From:*mulls* Either way, thank you for that story!
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From:Word.
Castiel watching Anna and Dean was fascinating.
That made the entire episode for me, especially as one poster above noted the possibility that Castiel totally had sex with Dean through Anna. Yee-haw! I'll go with that explanation to the ends of the world (which I'm guessing comes at the end of this season, roughly May '09 - *grin*).
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Am I the only one that hated emo!Anna? Cause really...
From:On the other hand Ruby showed more guts and loyalty and faith than the "fallen" angel Anna did. I'd been wishy washy on Ruby until now but she stepped up big time to help the boys protect emo!Anna.
On the plus side for a Dean/Castiel shipper I had to say that Uriel telling Dean Castiel "liked" him made me scream "liked, liked?" and then Dean went and saved his Cass when Allistair had him down for the count and was trying to pull some big ass spell on him. Go Dean! And, despite, the sex scene between Anna & Dean I still prefer the longing, piercing looks Cass send's Dean's way to anything emo!Anna dished out. Although, being human, Jensen shirtless is a wonderful thing. Too bad the writers won't go *there* between Cass & Dean cause they're my OTP. *g*
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Re: Am I the only one that hated emo!Anna? Cause really...
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From:Flashbacks to Lucivar, perhaps?
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From:All I'm doing is sitting over here, wiggling with glee that Dear Old Ossifer Kripke is actually going there, he's doing the ol' Yahweh can I say that here without anybody getting offended? dance, he's going back to the beginnings and showing the God of the old testament, the mean old fire and brimstone God who wasn't necessarily about loving kindness and forgiveness. This ain't Walt Disney's God, kiddies, and I'm just absolutely thrilled.
As for Anna, well, she fell. She's got her grace back, but she fell. Does that make her a real fallen angel, like Samael, now? Will she be allowed back before the throne or not? Or is she a free agent? Could she be like the Chuck Norris of Angels (which, you know, would be so damn cool)?
I'm with you about Ruby, too, at least now. I was wish-washy with her until last night but she sure delivered.
Uprising of demons... I think Neil Gaiman wrote about that, didn't he?
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From:I wonder if he's the reason they never came for Anna before now.
I like this idea! Although my assumption was that they never came for her because there was no need. She'd become mortal, so she was going to die anyway. But now, she was a threat.
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From:IT IS SNUGGLE-TIEMS NAO!!!! *WEEPS*
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From:huh. to me Uriel is a zealot. to me zealots are to root of all that is bad about religion. zealots taken to the extreme are the root off jihads and other excesses of religion.
what I see happening? Uriel could either triumph or fall. either way he will cause great harm.
either way, he's a pivotal character. but that's been pretty obvious from the start.
(and can I say shades of Earthian with the whole 'been here thousands of years observing' schtick?)
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From:i'll bet you a shiny dime.
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From:Dude. Dean made sweat love to an angel. We now have confirmation that Dean is apparently not only a sex god but can also woe the ladies with slow love.
I don't think I'll ever be able to actually comment coherently on anything else in the episode. Kudos to you for all the coherence.
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From:*ponders*
that comment totally loses something with the whole random word switching.
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Using the only angel icon currently in my set
From:Also, you're probably remembering Lucivar in the Black Jewels trilogy. Note that the above was my kneejerk response to the ep before going back to read all of your post, and hence you reminded me of Castiel's initial assertion that he's possessing a human who invited him in, and that's just weird when you compare how demons-in-humans react to physical or magical attack, as opposed to the way Anna was able to yank Castiel and Uriel out of there with her blood diagram early in the episode. And for that matter the way the angels can just discorporate whenever they see fit to disappear, which I don't recall demons being able to do except by escaping their hosts.
Also, I can't help but note that part of my fascination with watching Anna reclaiming a trinket that held the greater part of her nature and being invaded by light to become something more was, hello, opened the fobwatch?
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From:So they'd be too busy ripping into each other to think of joining up. Plus, there'd probably be too much backstabbing for a major movement to get started.
And I wonder if Dean were a special case--I got the impression (probably totally based on my own biases toward Dean) that Alastair's interest in him was unique. So, say, Bella, probably wasn't even offered the chance to get off the rack, especially not daily, and not by the Chief Tormentor. This is also due to Sam's comments from the first ep this season, that no demon would trade him for Dean. Leading me to think that in addition to wanting Sam topside (for whatever nefarious reason), but also that they maybe wanted Dean below. He'd have been a super scary demon, had "such potential" as Alastair put it.
And really, what was up with Castiel watching Anna and Dean?! That was made of pure awesome.
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