the birth of the squick

Random moment of squickery. And this is not related at all to anything except I got to thinking on my primary squicks and wondered if anyone else had really weird ones.

I mean, I have like, one major pairing squick (will run in the other direction and occasionally refilter my flist to avoid seeing even mention--yes, I know, My neuroses and I are one), and a few minor ones in SGA. But I developed this entire host of bizarre characterization squicks as well that always throw me, because honestly, there is no way to warn for them, some people have entirely differnet ways of seeing the character--which is fine! I swear! Except the sociopathic John thing, that is just stupid--okay, and the robot-of-no-real-emotions John thing, also mindblowingly stupid--but beyond that. And weird, *weird* plot squicks. And there's this entire *litany* of John-related and Rodney-related almost-squicks--I'll read them if this person write it, but not that person, and I'll only read it if this person was making me pre-read it early on and I'm allowed to insert such comments as WHY DID YOU DO THAT? EXPLAIN DAMMIT and then they do, and then I'm okay (see Astolat's Tango for fic that first squicked me, then much later, after a line by line with Amireal, really loving it and adding to re-read list). And I think Bone is still the only person I can read John/Ronon from, and I think a lot of that is because I was reading it well before I hardened into my OTP, and a lot of it because no other character suffered for the making of the pairing, which some John/Ronon fics I read seemed to have at least some bit of Rodney-left-out-and-hurt, which kind of sours it.

But okay, I'm asking for other people to tell me their weird squicks, I'll tell a few of the less-humiliating ones. I just want to feel less weird.



1.) partner betrayal - this is a stop-traffic squick. I'd like to thank rageprufrock for destroying my soul, because it's Pru and I read it, even though I knew I'd be homicidal before, during, and after. I love you, Pru, but OHMYGOD Directional Theory. Still not over that one. Immortality. Never, ever getting over that one. And that's been five years! Even the implications of it get to me in some really weird, primal way. Even if it's *informal*, I get mildly freaked out. But I am weird, and I embrace my weirdness.

2.) consensual non-con - okay, just go with this one. One of the characters wants to have sex, the other doesn't, or doesn't want it to have this certain kind of sex, first person drugs them and/or ties them up, they still say no, but then there's orgasm and they really really like it! *thinks* This also goes for the aliens made them have sex, but only when after, there seems to be no consequences, becuase the second person is still a-okay with everything even though they were totally not okay beforehand or even most of during, and the first person is smugly sure he did everyhing perfectly, which I have read not as many times as the first kind, but still, really, ewww. Okay, I have read some I could get through like that, and some I couldn't, and I think a lot depends on how I read author intent. eleveninches fic Them Other Boys Don't Know How to Act didn't even ping me on the freak-o-meter, but part of that is a.) I know her b.) she gave me a pre-fic synopsis so I knew exactly what I would be getting into and c.) I've read her fic enough to see where her characterization comes from, and so could go with it and laugh hysterically. Because honestly, that was funny.

3.) humiliation for use of teaching character a lesson - it's not conditional, I will always, always, always hate it (see some of the post-Trinities for dramatic interpretations on both sides; Rodney the trod-upon and bullied by everyone and cutting himself while people hope he suicides and John and Elizabeth teh evil monsters destroying his soul with their cruelty, cause for serious--wtf?). There are two or three really good fics that made me flinch with the humiliation teaches this character an important lesson--Transcendental is an excellent fic with a good example of John-learning-to-take-orders, and after my first few reads, I discovered the fine art of skipping the key points and moving to the fun plotty stuff again. And it's never come close to a few of the others that try to Teach Rodney To Be A Better Person, or John To Be More Emotionally Open, or Rodney To Not Take John For Granted or...yeah.

3b. Humiliation in general, but this is slippery-slope and there's no solid rule here. I just learned to hit back really really fast. More often than not, back. I think it honestly depends on how I read author intent in this one. Sometimes it's hysterical and funny and fun and reads like it, and sometimes, or a lot of time, it reads like a grudge against a certain character.

4.) death fic - this isn't as much a squick as a generalized preference of never, ever seeing it. Even long after post-death. I've read a few and some were good and a couple were great, and still, no.

5.) Anything At All To Do With Anyone Turned Into a Sex Slave. Period and end. I have yet to read a fic that can convince me otherwise. At least, not since 2005.

6.) Anything With Mutilation - I have been persuaded to a few. It took a lot of persuasion. And three people in chat telling me, they promised, I would love it. I would not want to kill them. I really, really wouldn't. They promised, promised, promised. They know I know where they lived. But general rule--no.

7.) Grudgefic - being OTC more than OTP half the time, you cannot freak me out more than by writing an entire story explaining how much John sucks as a human being and Rodney putting up with him and John's unspeakable gratefulness for it. Drives me *nuts*. Rodney doesn't get that treatmetn quite as much--well, outside a few key archives--but teh back button is well exercised. I mean, don't get me wrong, I get grudgefic--I who turned Lana into a heroin addict prostitute, special hell for that one--but see OTC and OTP. Squick. Anytime you spend an entire story punishing a character--oh God, that one with John agreeing he totally deserved to be drugged into Rodney's slave because he told Cameron about the lemon, Jesus H--no. Seriously. I am totally back button girl. And will possibly whimper about it to svmadelyn.

Hmm. Codicil to 7 - a lot of my issues with fic outside this list do have a great deal to do with John. I'm really not going to apologize for that one--I don't flame the authors or do antirecs or wander around talking about how much Author A sucks, but I'm not going to be sorry I can't read something I think just uses John in ways that to me make no sense. But I have found over time my patience gets thinned by my perception of either OOC or character abuse and there's this short list in my head of authors I simply don't trust and can no longer read without a specific rec from someone who knows me well enough, and some people write fic that to me, was so *wrong* I can't read anything else they write, because of that one fic, so all fics after it have that intent behind it. Which is freakishly limiting--there are reasons I trust implicitly anything ltlj recs, because I've read every one of her fics and her characterization of John, to me, is spot-on--and a couple of other reccers that tend toward the same taste I have. And I do recognize this is a taste issue--every fic I've mentined here is fic I like a lot, for various reasons, but is also fic that had a squick factor for me--it's not a quality issue. I don't tend to talk about fic I hated. It causes fine lines and early aging.

But sometimes--and this is just sometimes--I get the crazy feeling that it's not quite done anymore to have fairly specific tastes in fic, or to not like something due to those tastes, and the warnings debates had a side issue wandering through in a few ljs that seemed to emphasize the fact that if you have an issue with a particular kind of fic, you have a serious problem. I cannot read unequal OT3 or OT4, unless the author is basically Pru, or anything Rodney/Ronon period and end right there, and have come to really flinch around Sheppard/Weir. Some Ronon fic has started to get on my nerves, which means I'm skipping that pretty much consistently outside a specific rec, and some Weir fic have done the same thing. I get weird about John/Teyla now, and don't read it as much as I used to. The longer I'm in SGA, the more rigid the squicks and tastes have become, too. And there is definitely a--hmm. Maybe a generalized feeling that if you aren't reading all of it, or don't like some aspects of something, you're just not open minded enough. I am perfectly okay with everyone having their own take on characters, their own pairings, etc--except the sociopahtic John thing, God, just stop that shit--I just quietly, for the most part, exercise my option to stop and say "wow, that totally did not work for me at all."

The thing is, a squick is less a voluntary choice than a start of surprise, a "I am not enjoying this at all" and finding a pattern in it. Reading outside that is impossible, at least for me--if squick is hit, I cannot enjoy. If I do not enjoy, I stop doing it. It's not a personal judgement on the writer, though I can see, and have felt sometimes when I hit someone's squicks, that it can seem that way. It can also seem like a judgement--the non-con-really-he-meant-it I actually do get is a fantasy type and I don't actually think the authors are fine with rape and rohypnol being an awesome dating tool. And there is the part of me that knows that what we read is only a fraction of what the author really meant to get across, and what I get out of it can be diametrically opposite to what they meant. But the thing is, my reading will always trump author intent, with a few key DVD commentary exceptions that i have read that explained a lot something that bothered or confused me.

But saying what I do and do not like--outside those fandomwide things that everyone will claim--does feel sometimes like I'm quietly stepping on a landmine and waiting for it to blow. And I say this as someone who got feedback about The Principle of Exclusion stating that poor Rod was humiliated and ostracized by everyone--and you know, did my freakout in private that my author intent did not get the right thing across. I know that what we read isn't always the same as what the author meant.

Okay, now, so I feel less like a black peep at Easter--squicks? Issues? Oooh. In case I offended someone,and I'm pretty sure someone had to have been, I openly throw this one out--have I written anything that squicked you? How and why?

Comments

[idiasm.livejournal.com]

I feel this might end up long, and I don't really know you, which could be weird. But... you asked, so.

In terms of what you already listed - partner betrayal, yes muchly. Humiliation? I can't watch things where there's humiliation, and I definitely can't read them. Death depends on how it's done. Sex slavery, if it's slavery to only one master and it is at least somewhat consensual, maybe with happy abolitionist ending, or where it's like faked sex slavery for a certain purpose, that can be hot. Mutilation, maybe if it's better in the end and turns into some good h/c.

But in terms of squicks in general, nudaydreamer is sitting on my couch right now, and we were reading this at the same time, and we were discussing other things - certain words, certain quirks in writing, can be bad, as well. Even if something is a great premise, I can't stand reading it if it's full of typos or bad grammar or similar things.

In terms of something you've written squicking me - I really don't like Mensa!AU. But it's not yours in particular; I can't remember if I've read yours, actually, and I don't think I'm going to go click on it and find out. I read a couple early on, didn't like them, and won't read them now. It doesn't matter the author. I just ... I like normal AUs, if normal is you would say the characterization stays largely the same, and the relationships play out similarly, and all that. But I like our Rodney, and our John, and I don't really like any of the Mensa takes I did read, and it's now off my list. I'm not offended, I just don't click on them, no matter the author. And I've loved pretty much everything else you've written, as far as I can remember.

I think I've gotten pickier by far. I think it's a natural factor of time - you read things you really like, you automatically, even subconsciously, compare everything after to that first one, and sometimes they don't measure up.

Anyway, long, yes, but I don't think having squicks is a bad thing, or unusual.

[seperis.livejournal.com]

Interesitng on the MENSA--I read two and hated them so much I never read another one. I liked like, one or two before that--they were totally different entire *concept* universe types (One was sociopathic atlantis, which was fun for me) but the rest was--yes. That feeling I got from them of smug superiority to our canon characters and I hated that. I mean, I'm sure not all of them are that way? But I haven't read again to find out. And--since you brought up Exclusion--I'm pretty sure it might read the same way from a couple of the comments I got, which was kind of illuminating. I was trying, at the time, to write against that idea, that the au characters weren't any better or any worse, just different, with issues just as serious due to those differences--and maybe I disliked how Rod was presented and wanted to clarify his werid behavior. And honestly, i hate writing non-military John, mostly due to the fact that I feel--and this is just me, being weird--perceive this weird military bias, and really hate to add to it.

And hey, I love length. Always.

[idiasm.livejournal.com]

Yeah, smug superiority, that sounds right. I mean, it can work out (I think I've read that sociopathic one, or one similar? It was different in a really good way, made me think about how the characters worked in the real universe) but it's so hard to do. I like the AU where they transplant the characters into completely separate worlds, Yin's crack AUs. Or Farm in Iowa. The characterizations are the same but the situation is different. Whereas the Mensa ones, the place is the same but the people are screwed up. I don't know why that's more of a problem, but it is. Much more.

(Glad you're cool with length... maybe I'm crazy, but I think I tend to be way too verbose most times.)

[seperis.livejournal.com]

*nods* That makes sense to me completely. I avoid the Mensa AUs and a couple of other types that I already know are going to not work for me flatly.

Verbose is friendly. It helps with context. And frankly, in this kind of entry, I love seeing how people's mind works, the differences, the similiarites. It makes it easier when I'm posting something in general to know how people in general will react.

[beck-liz.livejournal.com]

Butting in here. :-) Weirdly, usually I much prefer the AUs that are only slightly different takes on our own universe, in a "what would happen if this happened" format. It's the ones that are totally different, where they're cowboys or something, that I usually don't like. So based on what I usually like, I should adore the Mensaverse. But something about Rod totally throws me and I can't stand him, and it seems to affect all around him. Maybe because it seems like he's such a fake person, to me.

(One that's similar to the Mensaverse but that I love is one in which Rodney is a Mountie and so is leading one of the gate teams and John's a scientist. I wish I could remember the name or who its by. But I think I like that one because despite that Rodney's not a scientist, he's still totally recognizable to me. Whereas Rod is not.)

[idiasm.livejournal.com]

OH oh oh, the Mountie one!!! I know that one. Actually, it's not bad. Here? http://magus-minor.livejournal.com/4439.html I only have it because it was requested on storyfinders recently. But for some reason, even though it's just a tiny AU, the characters are still themselves, you know? Which is what I like.

I agree about Rod... it just seems that he's totally out of character. I don't understand how he got like that, and the one or two fics I started reading about it were just weird, didn't explain it. Because to me, in an AU like that, they have to come from the same place, you know? At least ultimately. But I just can't see it, in this case. And I didn't like the John characterizations either, although that might have been a factor with the Rod thing.

[beck-liz.livejournal.com]

Yep, that's it! I liked that one.

But for some reason, even though it's just a tiny AU, the characters are still themselves, you know? Which is what I like.

Exactly! The differences between them and the original characters are reasonable and explainable.

I agree about Rod... it just seems that he's totally out of character.

Well, I wouldn't say OOC, because we've never seen him before or since to know whether he was OOC for him. But he's so very different from our Rodney that I can't figure out how they got there. And it doesn't help that I pretty much took an instant dislike to him.