two highly recommended warnings essays

As This Is My Life

So apparently, someone doing roadwork cut through our cable line, and we have a.) no cable, b.) no internet and c.) no phone. Which means tonight, may not be on if I can't get the tethering to work between John II and Arthur. However, Arthur the G1 and I are going to bond like whoa. Just. G3 is not very fast. So we'll see how that's going to work out.

ETA: Have internetz! They fixed it! Shocking.

Warnings

Sexual Assault, Triggering, and Warnings: An Essay by impertinence

Warning: Very explicit discussion of sexual assault and the nature, anatomy, cause & effect of triggers. Is itself triggery.

In response to this essay, I've had a complete reversal on my general attitude of whatever on warnings. Sure, it should not take someone gutting themselves publicly for me to work out why this is so important, but there you go, that's what it actually took in this case. That is perhaps one of the hardest things I've read in the last year, bar none. Recommended reading no matter what side of the warning debate you are on and in my opinion required reading if you're going to debate this topic at all, ever, anywhere.

Also recommended:

Warnings by zvi_likes_tv at Dreamwidth, with an alternate perspective on the warning issue, along with very good conversations in comments (actually, both essays have both great and faintly terrifying commentary). I'm going to say whatever side you are on, this, too, should be read thoroughly before engaging.

ETA: reginagiraffe linked in comments to kalpurna's post on easy ways to do warnings. We shall all read and learn and do better.

For me, I think I'll just automatically add a line to all headers (and if I don't, someone for the love of God slap me for stupidity; I'm adding it to my autotext header in MSWord now) for Warning and either enter None or See Cut for a separate section before the story starts. I don't often have the more common trigger issues in my fic, but honestly, since I haven't thought about warnings, I very well may have and just haven't paid attention to it.

Comments

Re: Original anonymouse here, more personal response to you, shopfront.

[seperis.livejournal.com]

Do either of you mind if I direct link to this convo until such a time as shopfront feels comfortable making an independent post? I didn't want to interrupt your conversation or spotlight it and break anyone's comfort level.

Conversely, if you want it screened at any time for any reason, please tell me and I'll do so immediately. Here or direct email me at seperis@gmail.com.

Copying this to a reply to shopfront as well.

Re: Original anonymouse here, more personal response to you, shopfront.

[(Anonymous)]

Thank you, I would, in fact, very much appreciate that.

It was my original intention to ask you for that, after I'd ascertained whether shopfront was comfortable with this being linked to, but by the time she did say she was, I was back in my anxiety zone of not knowing whether you might feel I'd expressed my thoughts on the matter too vociferously, and were therefore staying out of it, because I'd offended you.

(That'd be a perfect example of automatic thoughts and catastrophising right there, for anyone who cares to read this - this whole debate has gotten to me a fair bit, so I'm kind of swerving between "I believe this needs to be said" and "What if that means I offend people/am a horrible person for saying it?" Depressed logic, it is nothing like earth logic. *sigh*)

Re: Original anonymouse here, more personal response to you, shopfront.

[seperis.livejournal.com]

I was back in my anxiety zone of not knowing whether you might feel I'd expressed my thoughts on the matter too vociferously, and were therefore staying out of it, because I'd offended you.

Oh, I'm sorry I did that. I should have guessed how that would look. You both were having such an interesting conversation, I didn't want to intrude and spoil the flow or make anyone self-conscious. Trust me, I've been following along every time I got a notice this thread had updated and it's been, to say the least, riveting.

That'd be a perfect example of automatic thoughts and catastrophising right there, for anyone who cares to read this - this whole debate has gotten to me a fair bit, so I'm kind of swerving between "I believe this needs to be said" and "What if that means I offend people/am a horrible person for saying it?" Depressed logic, it is nothing like earth logic. *sigh*

There's utterly nothing said here offensive, even to asshats (for which I admire your restraint). I'm very, very sorry that I gave the wrong impression; I was worried anything I injected would come across as either ignorant or weirdly condescending, and I wanted you both to feel comfortable and safe enough to express what you were feeling without the impression anyone, including me, was passing judgment. I apologize for that.

I'll do a direct link in a separate entry either tonight or tomorrow; I don't want it to drown beneath the current events today. If there's anything else I can do, don't hesitate to contact here or email; I check my anonymous comments first now since those are the ones that need the attention the most quickly and currently have the most interesting things to say.

I know how sensitive and personal this topic is, so please, if at any time you don't feel comfortable or safe with what is visible, I'll screen or partially screen as needed. But I really think reading it will give others who read this a lot of needed context; I wish you didn't have to go through this to give it, but the gift is husgely appreciated and I believe others who read it will have a better idea of why the warnings debates are so necessary. Thank you very, very much for what you've written. And continue as long as you wish; I'm monitoring this thread directly to make sure it continues to be comfortable.

Re: Original anonymouse here, more personal response to you, shopfront.

[(Anonymous)]

Oh, I'm sorry I did that. I should have guessed how that would look.

Thank you for apologising, although it really wasn't necessary. I don't expect anyone to be able to read my mind, and I gave no indication, so you couldn't have known. It would be silly of me to expect otherwise. And I went into this conversation knowingly, and aware that I might end up feeling that way, so I could control it enough so it didn't upset me in any significant manner. I just couldn't prevent it from popping into my head and stop me from asking you outright, because that would have augmented the anxiety, if that makes any sense? And I mentioned it only because I thought it illustrated the automatic thoughts thing quite nicely, but it was my responsibility to enter the discussion in the first place.(Reading some of the comments aimed at survivors was what distressed me the most, really. I can't even grasp as to how some of them must be feeling.)

I was worried anything I injected would come across as either ignorant or weirdly condescending

Replace "condescending" with "stupid", and you know how I feel most days every time I'm talking to someone I don't already know very well and trust (and on worse days, even then). It's something I've been working on for 6 years now, and I've got a hell of a lot better at it, but my (mistaken) default position in social contexts is still that I'm... wrong, awkward, uninteresting, stupid, pick a self-deprecating term, it'll have been in my head, a billion times. I hope I'm getting better at recognising those thought patterns now and try to actively work against them, but whilst I'm rationally there, emotionally my MO is still "I'm not ok, you're ok", most of the time. (Another classic psychology text, google "I'm ok, you're ok" if you are interested in finding out.)

I've seen that shopfront has made her post (and made many valuable and interesting points), and I've linked to this thread from the comments there. I'd still appreciate it if you still linked to this in a separate post though, as I feel it provides some more concrete examples in some places that may make things more understandable for people, and I get the impression you have a fair bit of fandom traffic on your journal.

Thank you very, very much for your sensitivity and repeated offers of screening, I shall bear them in mind, though I hope it won't be necessary. But I appreciate the attention you've paid to this far more than I can express; many people in fandom should take you as an example in how to conduct yourself in these kind of discussions, imho.

(And I gather, from your other comment that you have first hand experience with depression, at least, so I just wanted to express my sympathy for that being the case. Ironically, and from a more detached/logical perspective, it serves as an apt example as to how wide the spectrum of mental health issues really is (with you understanding the depression side, but initially not the triggering one, I mean), and that you cannot simply lump everyone together in one group and stick a label on it.)

Re: Original anonymouse here, more personal response to you, shopfront.

[shopfront.livejournal.com]

I want to quickly jump in and echo my conversation partner in saying thank you for this being such a safe thread for us to be talking in, and for taking the care to make sure we knew we have access to further screening if we need it. I've mentioned in the comments of my post how comfortable I felt here despite that the content pretty much automatically had me on the edge of freaking out that someone was going to jump on me for saying something wrong, and I want to make sure you know because, well, the comments of my post are an obscure place for you to spot it. It's pretty much impossible for me to have a conversation about this in this sort of detail without large helpings of anxiety and self-doubt, in addition to being in a public place and a post by someone I didn't already know, and you've been a fantastic host. I don't think you could have made me feel more comfortable than you already did. So, thank you for that.