because it is very early and I'm very awake

[seperis]

The horrible danger of insomnia combined with friendsfriends--God. It's *crack*. I am totally understanding the draw. Currently working on avoiding ep reviews nad spoilers, since I haen't watched The Return yet.

Anyway, while cruising along, I came across an entry--oh, just an entry of SGA squee, pre-episode, mentioning this and that and then, randomly at the end, a sudden diatribe against Joe Flanigan's acting skills. There was generalized horror and repugnance and the usual--weirdly usual, almost rote--discussion of the level of suckitude, so normal I don't even *notice* with any more than a blink.

Huh, I said, and as usual, skimmed and wandered off.

But it being five in the morning, I thought, well. It's fandom, and this is what we do. We sit around dissecting shows, characters, and actors. So I have to ask, because I can--um, what the hell?

I don't pretend to be anything close to an expert on acting, other than hoping Keanu Reeves is given few lines at any given time and a lot of really good shots of him being hot. That's as far as I get on appreciating this nebulous realm of 'good' versus 'bad'. But the fairly constant discussion of Joe Flanigan's lack of talent, lack of emoting, lack of this, lack of that--often paired up, oddly enough, with essays on David Hewlett's brilliance at whatever the poster has watched/did watch/is watching--it really makes me wonder. Otherwise squeeful individuals break into really *sudden* critiques of things like how Joe performed a ten second facial expression during a scene, or lapse into--and this is what's jarring, I'm reading along on meta and halfway through the paragraph just--boom. This sudden really *odd* invective. And at first it was annoying, then I progressed to the shrug/personal taste, then I started to doubt myself and wonder if there was something wrong with *me* that I wasn't climbing on the Joe Sucks At His Job Bandwagon, and progressed to think, wait. Am I sitting here thinking I need to *look* for reasons to critique an actor because half my fandom spends quality time--and a serious number of entries--telling me that he sucks? Was my John bias showing?

Wait, I thought. I like the character of John. The character is played by Joe, who plays the character of John in a way I like. Ergo, I think I like how Joe does his job. I remembered the stuff thepouncer sent me and thought, huh. I liked that, too. That was kind of a relief.

I think at this point, it's just the build-up of seeing it so often--wow, so damned often, Jesus--and seeing it, not always, but a good chunk of the time, in direct contrast to a meta on DH's fantastical talent. Long, long entries on fantastical talent. Long, long entries on fantastical talent and etcetera. And you know, the coolness is there to love the actor. What I can't quite work out is how slamming Joe comes into a essay about how great DH is. Is that--supporting evidence or something? That kind of loses me in wondering what on earth the point is. I'm not sure how repeating in various formats how *much* Joe sucks is somehow going to make the DH adulation more convincing. I mean, I was sort of convinced without it? Then I just got irritated.

So I had this thought. It's a stupid thought, but then, everyone has stupid thoughts and they post them anyway. I was wondering, is there a direct correlation between how dramatic/flamboyant a character is--think McKay, Lex Luthor, Lionel Luthor, Justin Taylor--and the higher incident of actor popularity? I'm thinking of how TW in SV also picked up a lot of flack for being a sucky actor, with the exception of the times he was very flamboyant--Red comes to mind, and the beginning of season three that I can never remember the name of. Or Brian, for that matter in QaF.

Hmm. I feel this weird need to ponder this, but I also feel a real need to clean my bathroom, and neither are getting done at this second, because my greater need is to blankly stare at my flist in hopes I'll get sleepy. I'm just--weirded out by it, I think.

Comments

[trobadora]

. And it was--really, really frustrating, to feel like a lone John fan surrounded constantly by this loud, endless noise of omghewlettmckaygodyes with a hefty side order of joesheppardsucksdienow.

That is exactly how I feel at times. Thankfully I have someone to rant to as well, or I'd have gone utterly bonkers by now. And then, sometimes, someone comes out with a post like this, and all the Shep/JF fans suddenly come out of the woodwork. I think we're just not as loud as the DH fangirls.

(Honestly, I love DH. But at this point, "DH fangirl" hals almost become an insult for me.

[druidspell.livejournal.com]

I think maybe it's the character of Rodney rubbing off on the DH fangirls--Rodney's very in-your-face, very "I'm so very right and you are wrong, wrong, so very pathetically wrong" at times, and his fans just absorbed that attitude in an unfortunate way.
Whereas John is more subtle, a little more oddball, less in-your-face... but he can be sharp and on-target and "I can kill you in 47 different ways without breaking a sweat, but I'll let you live... or not." And some of JF's fans can definitely do that, as well.
Character influences fans? Or fans just being that way naturally? Are DH's fangirls naturally more "I'm right and you are horribly wrong" and JF's fangirls naturally more "I'll put up with you to a point, but then I'm gonna make your momma cry when she sees what I've done to you"? Or did our favorite characters make us this way? Discuss.

[trobadora]

Actually, I think it may be that natural extroverts find it easier to understand an extrovert like Rodney, and introverts find it easier to understand Sheppard even where extroverts seem to find him puzzling. *g*

[seperis.livejournal.com]

For me, it's--I don't know *what* it is. Rodney's would be, should be, in every way *is* my natural character choice in attitude, in his position in the show--adn he's not. And I don't know *why*.

I mean, yes, part of it is the vaguely enigmatic quality he has going on, and part of it is the sheer hotness. But. No. I think it *could* be the introvert in him that attracts me, his self-containment, the way he--he belongs to himself so thoroughly, that he only gives of himself no more than absolutely required. And the way he give up, like it kills something in him to even consider it, the way he really can't do it.

So in this fandom, I constantly feel off-step--my OTC is the one that *shouldn't* be, and who lives so far inside his head that I'm constantly amazed he's still able to be in a room with people and interact. God.

I really want to feed him brownies. Dammit.

[seperis.livejournal.com]

And by he in the second paragraph ,I mean John God. Pronouns.

[trobadora]

Hehehe, not like anyone could call Rodney enigmatic! *giggles at the idea*

[trobadora]

It's interesting that Sheppard isn't your "natural" choice - for me, he very much is.

his self-containment, the way he--he belongs to himself so thoroughly, that he only gives of himself no more than absolutely required

That's beautifully put. I can't even put into words exactly why I love you, because it's not just all the single things about him (like the ones you name), but the way they come together. He's a character who immediately clicked for me, who just made sense in every way.

Oh, John. *cuddles John*

I feel very out of place in this fandom sometimes, considering how many people don't seem to think he makes any sense at all, or who see him as a blank canvas on which they can paint anything.

[seperis.livejournal.com]

I feel very out of place in this fandom sometimes, considering how many people don't seem to think he makes any sense at all, or who see him as a blank canvas on which they can paint anything.

A lot of my current love of gen John fic is that most people *don't* write a gen John unless they genuinely like him and while I love my pairing, the majority of the pairing stories I read simply do not give a variation of John that comes close to how I view the character. This isn't necessarily a criticism either--people love Rodney best (or more easily), that'll be their focus, good to go. But from a purely selfish standpoint, that doesn't do much for me and does leave me with a low level--irritation? Dissatisfaction?--that I'm not finding what I need either in fandom.

[trobadora]

You know, that hadn't occurred to me. I've always enjoyed good gen as much as good slash, but in SGA, some of the best Sheppard characterisations seem to be gen. Actually, I've noticed that even in slash, there are many first time stories where I'm fine with the Sheppard characterisation until they actually get involved, at which point Sheppard seems to be receiving a complete personality transplant.

[druidspell.livejournal.com]

I love all of John's team.
But the reason that John is (and always will be) my OTC isn't because he and I are both introverts, or because I think that Sheppard is inherently better than any of the other characters, is because he just seems so REAL to me.

I mean, I know people like John Sheppard. They made a choice, it had unexpected consequences, and they weren't (and aren't) always prepared for exactly what those consequences will be, but they do
their best to deal and go on with their life anyway.

Case in (fairly long) point: John Sheppard was in Antarctica because at some point in time, he decided to join the Air Force. He then completed training to be an officer, and eventually was stationed in Afghanistan where he screwed up by doing what he thought was right (and what his COs thought directly conflicted with his orders).
Once in Antarctica, he made the best of it ("I kind of like it"), and when a weird glowing squid thing came out of the ice to attack the chopper he was piloting, he did the best he could, landed, and ended up going under the ice. Where he sat in a chair, activated the Ancient Tech like no one's business, and was bullied onto the expedition roster. He went through (presumably) a crash course on the Stargate Program, the history of the Ancients, and Would-you-like-to-be-on-the-expedition-why-of-course-you-would-it's-the-opportunity-of-a-lifetime. And then he went on a mission where he ended up having to shoot his CO, and suddenly, he's in charge of the military force of an expedition he joined at the very last minute.

Point is, John Sheppard did not ask for this life. He wanted to be a pilot, he joined the USAF. The rest of it kind of fell into place like particularly screwed-up dominoes. But John deals with it the best he can, and he's not so over-the-top that you'd think he never has any doubts, because obviously he does. He doesn't actually have the experience of a good base commander, but he does his damnedest not to let his people down. He's a REAL person.

And I like that, because that makes him seem like someone that I could know, and not just a character on a (really cool) TV show that's so far beyond my ken as to be laughable. McKay, however cool and smart I think he is, is nothing like anyone I've ever met before in my life; it fits him for the purposes of the show, because I don't think the world could stand too many Rodney McKays, but it doesn't fit for purposes of becoming my OTC, because I just can't relate to him. Teyla and Ronon, god knows I love all of John's team, I don't know anyone like them. They're kind of like ideals, less like real people I might meet on the street, all unknowing. They're so strong and persistent and patient (in different ways, but they both have these traits) that I look up to them in a way, but I don't feel like they're real in the same way that John, my lovably-flawed and human John, seems to be.
*debates copy-pasting all of her comments into her journal for the purposes of fandom-meta*

[seperis.livejournal.com]

YES. YES A THOUSAND TIMES YES.

[fluffyllama.livejournal.com]

Oh my god, I think I love you all for this. I can no longer even choose between my love for the characters, but since I've been reading all the linked reviews in the newsletter this series I've grown very tired of the 'JF sucks' crap.

Point is, John Sheppard did not ask for this life. He wanted to be a pilot, he joined the USAF. The rest of it kind of fell into place like particularly screwed-up dominoes.

Ooh, I think I have a clue as to part of my fascination right there. I'm no introvert, but I can definitely identify with that!

[seperis.livejournal.com]

I want to give us all little badges of "Joe and Sheppard are cool too!" So we can recognize each other or something. *grins*

[trobadora]

I'd wear one. :D

[druidspell.livejournal.com]

I'd wear one, too!